From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from firstgate.proxmox.com (firstgate.proxmox.com [212.224.123.68]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.proxmox.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5131061EA8 for ; Fri, 10 Jul 2020 19:31:14 +0200 (CEST) Received: from firstgate.proxmox.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by firstgate.proxmox.com (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 43A06251B7 for ; Fri, 10 Jul 2020 19:31:14 +0200 (CEST) Received: from mout.web.de (mout.web.de [212.227.17.12]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-256) server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by firstgate.proxmox.com (Proxmox) with ESMTPS id CA263251AC for ; Fri, 10 Jul 2020 19:31:10 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=web.de; s=dbaedf251592; t=1594402270; bh=9t7hqgpqd9FKTn94UiyepgvzyGvWxuogtAvc/HjTShg=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Subject:From:To:References:Date:In-Reply-To; b=SGVeIIhWtywxEYWww6yie5mOvWuqqqF4FEWXQ1kPVIm5CdryGiJP5HPnOEYdV3RpS EO9RXCMyIXkzFCJN762UaWEifT4kIs1K0OVAo2W4/vR6Bv6xC9pWciOgSHt6lbNsFc vhk6euG36lEJAzYcBtk+pN8gGAP5AAfEh/2N3t6s= X-UI-Sender-Class: c548c8c5-30a9-4db5-a2e7-cb6cb037b8f9 Received: from Rolands-MacBook-Pro.cybercon.de ([5.147.253.138]) by smtp.web.de (mrweb106 [213.165.67.124]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1MyvBA-1kpe160t86-00vz1Y; Fri, 10 Jul 2020 19:31:10 +0200 From: Roland To: Thomas Lamprecht , Proxmox VE user list , Dietmar Maurer , martin@proxmox.com References: <29674be5-026b-0a89-29ba-3951a99048b1@web.de> <1935605059.460.1594382980972@webmail.proxmox.com> <147b5bcd-ca6d-dd89-7389-d9a0e5de4726@web.de> <89ad8a6e-4d67-4782-9c0c-e403f7bde090@proxmox.com> <883f66d0-cee9-fa5b-e914-fb8cc63bb5f9@web.de> <8433ecf2-0a9e-6a2f-2c5e-08a2d6967190@proxmox.com> <57e9a9be-0907-d0c8-4ff7-8015c1585584@web.de> Message-ID: <10bb508e-3b24-3d1e-e15f-33fc0b5d9eac@web.de> Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2020 19:31:10 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.13; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.10.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <57e9a9be-0907-d0c8-4ff7-8015c1585584@web.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:Av6bmylbRrEuQNpQkVckz0gIfMiBymi4HDOwbL1pk+wKxd4tgNh jjempOTTSMxyqN5JBo/k9+kWZZeIck2FfG6JVVP3jbUVuub9Gj+1ZKicY3C/pDHGP6qdUkf HH+05sK4Qj0R4458eMiwIXsPtmd9OxgqGZOHBddOc1GVsRnEhW6nBKlEeujojwlLJZO4QEU vYTjuujlm8IXjVdIUwUFQ== X-Spam-Flag: NO X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:BvSGDAVu3qU=:sa7JD+Dg2whdznY8+kCFAO NGy7/ujJquoX6xLv7oZyNa49V3elH5sLhrl7cmhcGlBWn8RXHEv8lwEFDMkYuSPf90SV4TYYU nXDo7rcoADFG6UbeOJRm7BwP3+f/kfi02WcsCj++v2Qs7p2Nos7HXbWpgIfBjJEuFK6zIsgAM tHYUu1lFBRIuDXaDlNbe2+kre+5HVbLShA2a68GgUyDIyvsCefGfhVp6lOCIMA4yETO+Oz/Ht 72J4jWDOm7DBRhcCxkDPGMHTI9GY2er38Kiikz/teDmqEzzKRSmnYZvMA3E2tuBV/b4Dc2ZDs Znr1eNax48nE3aa8/0rlgI4HMWuiX0900jq0Gr4Rm2JR7qu66U64vWV4r53JD0GLdBiBc6wSz +igdCfOTD9ewF7UNpcyeAZI3TVQ4B7Oh8LYrS0oAsJeexqZCrYaesXua6mbL8nPrWI1dq9B+B HItUTRBP3VvigvHH+kDJ1vb2vfMGWmkr8QnulJQYmYZlT9oSVHnR+DJ4rDT7G3CKFhB5kYOtk YHC+2XU/3n3b80QYJngtsvFXQIS0IYe8bmf2vAR05t2LZfR9ZrGKyIxb0p+///YyEB5UrU23M Qiv2JtFFvq6LVH+AYICMxJHRnHYVR9bw/FjDwc4nySSWJMgq9/OLTrMHeam146JPF2KGWUzcu t6PD/SJwdz0Nt8PvlMM+oMbKJRgFx5/s+EEoKbJqLdNvaWEAHPN6VsRNcuz8By52k2Crs59vP jiGYxhLQUN/FqB3HHN76uZJG6VNJuMftq3MtgQNMVuNeKTSVCqz8LrHItsmsqXa4wiNsrIhhx DfdN0jL5qfXc1F/+F5g6YHEc/01ZSEPcHmmavuC1/MjIlrYI6vE9ttPCMJ58N/llMDz9/WZFi Fwh5+WlUVnnGj/SmTjROHqPtg1/ui2q52Nxpr83RHTLogfReDk2RU97FQf61j+fZir7KTrDPi g4irc6eiCeF78IMIFLaeaRPqDIvJ7ylDise3DvPsRwAr/0Xle2hf5BPS3oAg1+PUG2q2J3rID 0fHe8D/8n0xgZ6+TMrdyj5ZYNAbE2KJOXua5N90bgjaKIR9wvxDbe4u375TJolsDipCrFXv1C 5+MnoDemNA0q6CSUg3mV6afJiGpORNCy+BTyv/HoX09SQiyZlJGyMHZuLfXMCmHjhU2qckT7C e2dmrAr42exzuAjwDoG9VeLJercAnbVxyXt7mj4ul/FdaNOeq4NW2O2eU1qG6mriqfpOvgiQ2 89ANNAB2Fc+mWfKSq X-SPAM-LEVEL: Spam detection results: 0 AWL -0.001 Adjusted score from AWL reputation of From: address DKIM_SIGNED 0.1 Message has a DKIM or DK signature, not necessarily valid DKIM_VALID -0.1 Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature DKIM_VALID_AU -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from author's domain DKIM_VALID_EF -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from envelope-from domain FREEMAIL_FROM 0.001 Sender email is commonly abused enduser mail provider RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW -0.7 Sender listed at https://www.dnswl.org/, low trust RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3 0.001 Good reputation (+3) RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL 0.001 Mailspike good senders SPF_HELO_NONE 0.001 SPF: HELO does not publish an SPF Record SPF_PASS -0.001 SPF: sender matches SPF record URIBL_BLOCKED 0.001 ADMINISTRATOR NOTICE: The query to URIBL was blocked. See http://wiki.apache.org/spamassassin/DnsBlocklists#dnsbl-block for more information. [veeam.com, vmware.com, proxmox.com] Subject: Re: [PVE-User] Proxmox Backup Server (beta) X-BeenThere: pve-user@lists.proxmox.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Proxmox VE user list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2020 17:31:14 -0000 works like a charm. 2 seconds for finishing an incremental backup job. works with qcow2, works with zvol. (did not test restore yet) I'm impressed.=C2=A0 congratulations! roland INFO: starting new backup job: vzdump 101 --node pve1.local --storage pbs.local --quiet 1 --mailnotification always --all 0 --compress zstd =2D-mode snapshot INFO: Starting Backup of VM 101 (qemu) INFO: Backup started at 2020-07-10 19:16:03 INFO: status =3D running INFO: VM Name: grafana.local INFO: include disk 'scsi0' 'local-zfs-files:101/vm-101-disk-0.qcow2' 20G INFO: backup mode: snapshot INFO: ionice priority: 7 INFO: creating Proxmox Backup Server archive 'vm/101/2020-07-10T17:16:03Z' INFO: issuing guest-agent 'fs-freeze' command INFO: issuing guest-agent 'fs-thaw' command INFO: started backup task '5a0a0ef3-2802-42e0-acc3-06147ad1549f' INFO: resuming VM again INFO: using fast incremental mode (dirty-bitmap), 48.0 MiB dirty of 20.0 GiB total INFO: status: 100% (48.0 MiB of 48.0 MiB), duration 1, read: 48.0 MiB/s, write: 48.0 MiB/s INFO: backup was done incrementally, reused 19.95 GiB (99%) INFO: transferred 48.00 MiB in 1 seconds (48.0 MiB/s) INFO: run: /usr/bin/proxmox-backup-client prune vm/101 --quiet 1 =2D-keep-last 2 --repository root@pam@172.16.37.106:ds_backup1 INFO: vm/101/2020-07-10T17:13:29Z Fri Jul 10 19:13:29 2020 remove INFO: Finished Backup of VM 101 (00:00:02) INFO: Backup finished at 2020-07-10 19:16:05 INFO: Backup job finished successfully TASK OK Am 10.07.20 um 16:46 schrieb Roland: > wo this is great to hear, thanks ! > > Am 10.07.20 um 16:15 schrieb Thomas Lamprecht: >> On 10.07.20 16:06, Roland wrote: >>> i think there may be a misunderstanding here or i was not clear enough >>> to express what i meant. >>> >>> i guess in terms of backup storage,=C2=A0 pbs is doing similar to what >>> borgbackup does - so indeed that IS i/o and storage effient , but that >>> refers to the backup target side. >>> >>> but what about the backup source? >>> >>> I was referring to VMware cbt as that is a means of avoiding I/O on th= e >>> VM storage, i.e. the backup source. >>> >>> afaik, proxmox/kvm does not (yet) have something like that !? >> Proxmox Backup Server and Proxmox VE supports tracking what changed wit= h >> dirty-bitmaps, this avoids reading anything from the storage and sendin= g >> anything over the network that has not changed. >> >>> I you have lot's of terabytes of VM disks, each incremental backup run >>> will hog the VMs storage (the same like full backup). >>> >>> In VMware, this is adressed with "changed block tracking", as a backup >>> agent can determine which blocks of a VMs disks have changed between >>> incremental backups, so it won't need to scan through the whole VMs >>> disks on each differential/incremental backup run. >> see above, we effectively support both - deduplication to reduce target >> storage impact and incremental backups to reduce source storage and >> network impact. >> >> https://pbs.proxmox.com/docs/introduction.html#main-features >> >>> see: >>> https://kb.vmware.com/s/article/1020128 >>> https://helpcenter.veeam.com/docs/backup/vsphere/changed_block_trackin= g.html?ver=3D100 >>> >>> >>> i don't want to criticize proxmox, i think proxmox is fantastic, i jus= t >>> want to know what we get ( and what we don't get). >>> >> No worries, no offense taken ;) >> >> cheers, >> Thomas >> >>